Stolen Innocence or Innocent Beauty?

18 Jul

By Parisienne

What is the obsession with child beauty pageants? In 2001 HBO put out a disturbing documentary entitled Living Dolls: The Making of a Child Beauty Queen (click here to see video) it won an Emmy for outstanding picture in 2001. Also, you may recall the dark comedy Little Miss Sunshine in 2006, which dealt with the irony of child beauty pageants. It was nominated for an Academy Award for best picture in 2006. Both television and film audiences were exposed to the sub-culture of child beauty pageants possibly for the first time. Has much changed since then?

We’ve all seen a Miss America beauty pageant on television.  Some of the women in the Miss America pageants have been in pageants since childhood.  In this article I will be discussing child beauty pageants.  Child beauty pageants began in the 1960’s. Pageants consisted of these events: modeling sportswear, evening attire, dance, and talent.  Some mothers lie about their child’s age(s) so their children can appear more mature and poised.  However, some pageants now require birth certificates to verify the ages of the children.  Prizes differ depending on the size of the contest. Some of these prizes include:

  • Radios
  • Bicycles
  • Grants
  • Cash awards
  • Trophies
  • Tiaras

The country’s largest beauty pageant is Universal Royalty pageant.  This is the pageant that is seen on Toddlers and Tiaras on TLC.  Every contestant receives and award for participating.  Sixty contestants from just 3 months to 30 years old compete in this pageant.

 Please click here to watch video.

 As soon as the child can sit up on his/her own, he/she is allowed to enter the pageant.  There is a minimum cost of $545 to enter the pageant that covers basic entry fees.  Plus an additional $395 just to have all the pageantry options available to the child.  The average cost of the pageant is around $655 and does NOT include lodging, food and travel.  The Grand Supreme winner of the pageant receives $1000, ten-inch crystal crown, a six foot trophy, entry paid in full to nationals, a teddy bear, long stemmed roses, a tote bag, satin rhinestone banner, gifts, video of the pageant and a photo on an advertisement for the pageant.[1]  With all of the expenses for the pageants I can now see why some children may feel pushed to win.   According to Worldnetweb.com Child abuse is the physical, sexual or emotional mistreatment of children.[2]  Do you think their parents are emotionally abusing the children who enter pageants?

Please join us for a discussion Tuesday 7/19/2011@7pE/12UTC

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176 Responses to “Stolen Innocence or Innocent Beauty?”

  1. Littlebells July 18, 2011 at 10:57 AM #

    Oh hell yes I do to your last question!!!!! I have NEVER watched T&T, but just the clips The Soup shows on Friday nights.

    I may offend some of our readers, but here goes: I think parents who enter these children in these pageants are some of the most self-absorbed, attention seeking, people who obviously have something unfulfilled in their own lives and are thrusting that fulfillment on to their children.

    Yes, I just said that. I don’t know of any normal parent who wishes to make their 4 year old look, walk, dance, and act like an adult. The world is already pushing our kids to grow up at a faster and faster rate. It doesn’t need parents helping.

    I LOVE you article Paris, but I HATE the subject. Of course that is not going to deter me from throwing in $42 in change. haha! 🙂

    • Parisienne July 18, 2011 at 7:20 PM #

      Thank you LittleBells! I saw a commercial for T&T and the little girl that was being profiled liked to do gymnastics but her mother wanted her to do pageants. The little girl did the pageant but she just stood there with no smile and all and was not happy. I don’t like seeing children forced to do something they don’t want to do.

  2. Open Book July 18, 2011 at 7:39 PM #

    Hi Paris & LB!

    I agree with u both. These child beauty pageants should be banned. I really think the parents have lost all sense of what’s ethical and have no clue the emotional damage they are doing to these young girls. Great article Paris this discussion is a much, much needed one I have a lot to say about this topic.

  3. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 12:29 AM #

    I have never seen T&T, but have seen the commercials and I do remember the Jon Benet Ramsey case. I remember seeing her in those costumes, dancing around on stage performing in those pageants. The whole thing just truly creeped me out. These young girls and boys for that matter are not old enough to have a say. I suppose some of these kids maybe really like doing it, but it is still creepy. I at times have felt kind of dirty watching the commercials.

    ITA with the comments that are currently posted here. I wonder is it more prevalent in certain areas of the country versus others? And if so why?

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 6:34 PM #

      Francesa,

      According to the video linked above the pageants are more prevalent in the South than in other parts of the country. There is no reason given as to why that is but it is my opinion that some people may want to recapture the “Old South” with the fancy balls and things like that.

      • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:01 PM #

        THat makes sense. I do not see that elsewhere, howeeeeeever, I do see pushy stage moms pushing their kids into every possible commercial and TV show. Would you consider that somewhat similar???

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:10 PM #

        That sounds very plausible Paris!

  4. ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 3:49 PM #

    So, I watched an episode of T & T (thought it best to watch one ahead of the discussion so I knew what people were talking about) and I’m shocked. I wish you could see my face because I can’t describe what I’m feeling or thinking!

    It’s going to be a good discussion tonight!

    • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 3:55 PM #

      Ozzie!!! *sobs* We are like two ships passing in the night!

      Ladies, especially OB, I’ve already given Paris a heads up as to my participation tonight. If you do not hear much from me it’s because this is such a sore spot for me because…well yeah, it’s pretty obvious these parents are friggin’ nuts. Anyway, I just wanted to tell you that I don’t have kind things to say and most of what would be coming out of my mouth would be horrible mean nasty things with swear words interspersed.

      If I can manage to keep myself from shoving my hand through the computer screen and trying to rip some people’s heads off, I will participate. Poor Paris had to listen to me last night! haha!

      Since I’m hear and of sound mind at the moment let me just say this: I don’t care how much these parents say their kids love doing this. It’s the largest pile of moose dingy ever! QUIT LIVING THROUGH YOUR 3,4,5….YEAR OLD DAUGHTER!!!!!!!

      • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 3:56 PM #

        and no it’s not anyone’s head on here I want to rip off. It’s those people who call themselves “moms and dads” in the videos.

        • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 4:01 PM #

          one last thing….these really set me off:

          and

          No words. WEll yes, I do, but they are not appropriate here….

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 5:19 PM #

        LittleBells,

        I completely understand if you don’t say much and thanks for the vids because I was just about to ask you for them. (stop reading my mind) I know you have self control, 🙂

  5. Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 5:57 PM #

    This YT clip is in regards to the little girl featured in the video that Open Book shared with me for this article. She is in her late teens now and no longer competes in pageants.

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:04 PM #

      Do u know these child pageants are a billion dollar industry? They are feeding off of parents desire for attention and easy success. This is so sad people continue to support this.

      Do u know they started having child beauty pageants in Ireland? They started having them in April.

      • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:15 PM #

        Are you friggin….????? of course it’s a billion dollar industry and they are laughing on their yachts and private jets! What is hilarious is that the parents don’t seem to care that they spend far more money than what they win. idiots…..

        • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:18 PM #

          I know it’s worse then Las Vegas because these parents are using their kids as pawns.

  6. Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 6:01 PM #

    Another video of Swan.

    • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 6:58 PM #

      I would LOOOOOOOOOOVE to hear her side of the story…..

  7. Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 6:54 PM #

    Alright I’m here….Hmph.

    🙂

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:20 PM #

      LittleBells,

      I appreciate that you are here. 🙂

  8. Open Book July 19, 2011 at 6:55 PM #

    Hi Everyone-

    Welcome to our discussion tonight. Please feel free to jump in. We welcome your questions and or comments.

    • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 6:59 PM #

      Hi OB!

      How are you?

      • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:06 PM #

        LB *Runs and hugs* Hi!

        And hello OB. Hope you’re well!

        Yes, videos for me to watch! 🙂

        • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:07 PM #

          hi everyone! LittleBells, I’m glad you are here. 🙂

          • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:12 PM #

            *thumbs up*

            • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:14 PM #

              Hi Paris!

              • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:17 PM #

                Hi Ozzie! how are you?

                • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:20 PM #

                  I’m good! You?

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:06 PM #

        Hi LB- I’m glad u decided to join us after all. I know it’s hard to hold back the not so pleasant words when watching this.

        • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:07 PM #

          yeah, well still not promising anything! 🙂

          *topples over from great big bear hug* Thanks Ozzie!

          • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:11 PM #

            LOL!!

            • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:13 PM #

              *personally duct tapping my hands to the side of my key board by use of my feet* haha!

              • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:15 PM #

                Well u know I do have the power to delete. So don’t hold back….LOL!!

                • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:18 PM #

                  No, I respect you way too much, but thank you. 🙂

              • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:17 PM #

                Littlebells,

                Don’t worry about it. The delete button works wonders. LOL

          • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:14 PM #

            LittleBells,

            To make you feel better, I found some info on a woman named Beatriz Gill. She started her own pageant that has make-up and costume regulations.

            She’s also trying to help the community.

            http://beatrizgill.blogspot.com/

            • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:19 PM #

              That’s awesome! I see she stops at 2009. do you think she’s still active!

              • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:44 PM #

                IDK, I haven’t found anything else as of yet but i’ll keep my eye out for it.

  9. Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:07 PM #

    Ozzie-

    Do they have child beauty pageants in GB yet?

    • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:16 PM #

      I think so but they’re not as popular. It doesn’t get much press.

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:21 PM #

        Why do u think GB has not fallen for this highway robbery, feed on emotionally insecure people scheme?

        • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:32 PM #

          No idea. You find parents bragging about school grades, which school they got into and any after school lessons (i.e. sport, music, languages, dancing etc.) than beauty pageants. There is pressure for anyone to look good and who has the best this or that but contests? No! You’d probably get a funny look and be asked why you’d want to do it if you told someone you took part!

          Just looked up when the first pageant took place here. It was 2006.

          • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:38 PM #

            Wait, Mum to the rescue! This willbe long!

            • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:46 PM #

              that’s great! your mom is awesome ozzie.

              • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:50 PM #

                I can’t shut her up! Help!

                • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:53 PM #

                  LOL let her talk. 🙂

                • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 8:02 PM #

                  Oh at last! I have a headache now! Let’s see how I can shorten this…

                  Miss World/Universe/UK/Whatever, used to be shown on TV years ago but the feminist movement got it taken off. Basically they said they were using girls/women as cattle. Since then it’s always been looked down on and veiwed as obscene. Like I said above intelligence is viewed as more important. Also, we tend to have an understated view when it comes to wealth and beauty. It’s not proper to display your wealth and beauty in vulger ways. Of course there are plenty of exceptions (Katie Price aka Jordan for example).

                  Anyway, one quote I managed to get out of her was “Intelligence stays, where as beauty can fade”. The she went on to another tangent and my brain melted! 🙂

                  • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:10 PM #

                    your mom is awesome. She’s so cool and she’s right too.

                  • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:58 PM #

                    YOUR MOM IS AWESOME!!!

          • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:58 PM #

            Really 2006?

            Wow!!

  10. Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:14 PM #

    Do u know these parents are going into debt and loosing their homes because they are spending money on these pageants. I think it’s like a gambling addiction IMO!

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:16 PM #

      yes i do know that I was astonished at the amount of money Swan’s mom spent on her. She spent almost 70,000 and the most that Swan won was 2,000 at that time so she was out 68,000.

    • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:18 PM #

      Really? Gosh! That’s just…….awful.

      This is going to get repeated alot tonight! Why? Just Why?

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:22 PM #

        I don’t know……She wanted it that badly. I watched almost the entire documentary that Open Book shared with me. Her home life was not great and the family did not have tons of money so i find it hard to believe that her mom actually put all that money into it.

        What I didn’t like is that she coerced Swan into doing the pageants.

        • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:23 PM #

          I think there is a lot of bribery and coercion unfortunately.

    • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:20 PM #

      *using nose* therapy. lots and lots of therapy.

  11. Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:22 PM #

    I look at my daughter and there is no way, NO WAY my husband and I would even think of entering her in something so vile and perverted. She is the happiest kid running around with her hair flopping all over, going through 5 wardrobe changes and ending up in the same shirt she’s been wearing 6 days in a row. She’s got food all over her face and the bottom of her feet are dirty. Happiest girl EVER!!!!!

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:24 PM #

      Money is the root of all evil. That’s all i can say.

  12. Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:23 PM #

    Paris-

    Do u think these pageants prey on poor people?

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:25 PM #

      of course they do. They get them pumped up to win so they poor everything they have into it monetary and emotionally wise.

      • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:26 PM #

        What about the emotional mental needs of the parents. Why do you think they do this other than fame and money?

    • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:25 PM #

      Paris,

      Do you also think that Hollywood stage parents fall under the same category? Kids aren’t being dressed up like a pageant but they are being pushed into every single commercial and TV show possible. I doubt they enjoy it. What do you think?

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:26 PM #

        yes i do. Same thing different scenery.

        • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:27 PM #

          Mhmm, mhmmm, mhmmm.

          • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:49 PM #

            Yes, they’re the same!

  13. Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:28 PM #

    Paris-

    This is a bit off topic but I think is somewhat similar to these beauty pageants. Anyway, this kid Nick Roses (this is from Deadline.com) “He has been accused of luring parents from small-town America to bring their children to his poorly run (according to the parents), expensive (at $3,000 a pop) acting workshops in Los Angeles with the promise to eventually sign the kids.”

    • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:29 PM #

      $3,000!!!!!!! What the *beeeeep*?

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:32 PM #

        I know and this talent agent Nick Roses is like 21 years old. I mean they are forking over 3,000 dollars to a kid who’s promising to get there child into TV commercials etc….

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:32 PM #

      The sad thing is and always will be, imo, people will never be ok with what they have been given. They aren’t thankful for the fact that they are just here. They chase something better and when that alludes them they take their frustrations out on those around them. People see this and take advantage of that with empty promises and the “fame seekers” fall for it over and over again.

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:33 PM #

        BRAVO!!!! Paris…ITA

        • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:33 PM #

          thank you. 🙂

          • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:35 PM #

            I concur with OB on that as well….very well put.

            • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 8:05 PM #

              *nods head*

  14. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 7:29 PM #

    Hello everyone

    Once again this whole topic really creeps me out. They look like little dolls, they don’t look real. I’m not sure how to even respond…

    • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:30 PM #

      with lots and lots of cursing….helped me.

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:34 PM #

        LittleBells,

        You are doing wonderfully, Breathe in through your nose and out through your mouth.

        • littlebells July 19, 2011 at 8:05 PM #

          🙂

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:32 PM #

      Hi Francesa!

      • Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:34 PM #

        Yes Hi Francesa! Sorry.

        • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 7:47 PM #

          Hi Francesa!

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:34 PM #

      Hi Francesa!

      Nice to see u!

  15. Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 7:36 PM #

    Ok, I have to ask this: how many of these little girls do you think have been sexually molested?

    yes, I know I went there, but I HAD to ask….Sorry if that creeps you out even more than you already are.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:38 PM #

      LittleBells,

      In all honesty, I don’t know I would hope not but you never know. That can happen anywhere. It doesn’t matter whether or not the child looks like Barbie.

  16. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 7:36 PM #

    LB-

    Look at the Lohan family. Lindsay started at a very young age with acting and commercials and look where she is now. Kids are not equipped to handle the trappings of fame etc. Now granted there are exceptions to this rule. I think Dakota Fanning, Emma Watson, even Jodie Foster to name a few, have so far weathered the storm.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:37 PM #

      Francesa,

      I agree with you but look at the family life too.

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:39 PM #

      Leonardo DiCaprio, Joseph Gordon-Levitt, Natalie Portman and Reese Witherspoon etc….

      Why do u think they managed to weather the storm?

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:40 PM #

        IMO, They all have a great support system, family life.

        • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:51 PM #

          True! But I think the parents did not pressure them. Meaning they did not allow the work to define who they were. Does that make sense?

          • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:52 PM #

            yes it does.

  17. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 7:38 PM #

    Not only molested, but what about how many pedophiles show up at these shows. OMG this is just wrong on so many levels.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:39 PM #

      Francesa,

      I agree with you 100%

  18. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 7:40 PM #

    Paris, yes I do agree you have to look at the family dynamic as well. But it makes you wonder how some come out okay, but others do not? Sarah Jessica Parker basically supported her whole family and she seems to have come out okay? I suppose there are just as many good as bad stories, but we usually only hear about the bad ones.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:42 PM #

      Also I think its what the person wants for him/herself. What is that person’s goal in the industry? I hope that makes sense.

  19. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 7:45 PM #

    But is a young child able to make such a sophisticated decision in regards to goal and/or wants from an industry that eats their young?

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:48 PM #

      No they don’t but some children are put into it so young that they don’t know the difference. That’s all they know.

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:49 PM #

      IMO! No…… I think it depends who these kids are surrounded by either on sets or at home. I think some parents let their kids run wild and let anyone raise them on sets etc….This is where u find kids growing up too fast etc…

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:51 PM #

        like drew barrymore.

        • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:52 PM #

          YEP!

  20. Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:50 PM #

    In the video linked above. A woman named Leslie Butler is featured. She started pageants when she was 3 wks old and by the age of 7 she had won 27 national titles. At that time, that’s all she knew how to do because she had been doing it…it became her way of life.

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 7:56 PM #

      See this is the problem. The parents put way too much importance on these pageants. So much so the kids are not able to have and develop their own identity. This is what I mean by not allowing the work to define who u are but instead allowing them to define the work they want to do. Does that make sense?

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 7:58 PM #

        yep totally does. Did you get a chance to watch the video at all Open Book?

        • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:01 PM #

          Yes! I watched all of them.

          • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:04 PM #

            I stopped when they put extensions on an 18 month old. I wanted to come through the screen at Swan’s mom at one point for making her wear earrings to a football game. Swan didn’t want to wear them and her mom basically said “if your team loses it will be your fault because you didn’t wear your lucky earrings.”

            • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:06 PM #

              Now did Swans mother pass away?

              • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:07 PM #

                yes she did. her father did as well. both of them died from cancer.

                • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 8:21 PM #

                  Just started watching the video. I feel bad for heer siblings too.

                  • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:25 PM #

                    I know me too.

                    • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 8:31 PM #

                      Ok, I may have a few tears in my eyes. She looks like the daughter of a woman I used to be friends with years ago. She treated her daughter in the exactly the same way but over gymnastics, piano/violin, ballet, the list goes on and on.

                      It’s bringing back bad memories and I know that the Mum still hasn’t changed her ways, as of a couple of weeks ago. I dread think what the child is like now.

                    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:54 PM #

                      I feel bad for your friend, Ozzie.

  21. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 7:58 PM #

    I find that really sad. By society standards I lived a pretty normal childhood. I did set goals etc late in high school, but my parents never pushed me one way or another. Always told me whatever I decided to do, I could it would just take hard work and dedication.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:02 PM #

      it is very sad. It does take hardwork and dedication that’s true. But sometimes though I think the parents are jealous of their children.

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:04 PM #

        OH MY GOSH! Jealous. I call them invasion of the body snatchers because one body is not enough.

        • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:06 PM #

          LOL so true Open Book, I want to say to them “You had your chance and didn’t take it. Now move out of the way.”

          • littlebells July 19, 2011 at 8:11 PM #

            …….friigin fraggin sfhhffthgcghjiugc!!!!!

          • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:16 PM #

            I think this is the worst form of emotional abuse. I mean society don’t think it’s bad because u don’t see any broken bones but these kids are broken emotionally. It’s so sad society don’t protect children from these parents who exhibit this behavior.

            • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:18 PM #

              Doing my research, I found that as of yet there is no government regulations.

              • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:19 PM #

                are no not is no…sorry. Just correcting myself.

              • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:29 PM #

                That’s not a surprise! Especially when u have a billion dollar industry at stake.

                • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:33 PM #

                  ok i have a question……..the children that compete in the pageant that is filmed for T&T how is that any different from the Gosselin kids? Exploitation is still exploitation. If I remember correctly TLC had to go to court because of some permits or something because the kids are “working” How does one “work” their everyday life? Am I making sense?

                  • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:36 PM #

                    Do you feel there is a difference between the two?

                    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:41 PM #

                      No I don’t think there is a difference not. I actually think society preys on the weak and vulnerable. These reality TV shows are an example of this. People still watch them and they love to see train wrecks so they can feel good about themselves. How is that o.k.?

                    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:45 PM #

                      I don’t feel there is a difference either. Money talks though and as long as the money flows in for the pageants i highly doubt the government will step in.

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:03 PM #

      U were truly blessed! And high five your parents for me.

  22. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 8:03 PM #

    Maybe not jealous, but envious. They live their dreams out through their kids. You always hear about the crazy mom or dad beating up the coach because their kid doesn’t get enough playing time etc.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:05 PM #

      or a coach made a call the parent didn’t like. How is that supposed to promote sportmanship?

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:10 PM #

      Yes! Actually in New Jersey some parents went to jail for beating up a coach at a little league game. But what about stage moms and dads? There are some real tools out there IMO!!

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:14 PM #

        Yes but there are “tools” everywhere. I know this is completely OT but look at Elton John for example. He used his sperm so his child could have his genes and be a great singer like him when he grows up? How does he know that his son wants to be a singer? Maybe he wants to work at a gas station or be a doctor. Doesn’t matter about the genes. What matters is how the child is brought up.

        • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:27 PM #

          SMH!!!! Wow! just Wow!

          • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:29 PM #

            well he said it. I’m just repeating what he said.

  23. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 8:11 PM #

    That’s the problem it doesn’t support sportsmanship. One thing that does drive me crazy is that we live in a society that “we are all winners, everyone gets a trophy” We are not teaching kids how to deal with loss. Which I believe spills over into their lives.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:15 PM #

      EXACTLY!!!!!!!!! Deal with the yin but not the yang.

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:16 PM #

        Francesa,

        I didn’t mean to yell at you but I got excited….sorry.

        • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:26 PM #

          LOL!!

          Well said Francesa…..

          I will go one step further. I think these parents make these kids emotionally dependent on them. This is the worst form of psychological warfare. They give them a false sense of security then yank the rug whenever the child hesitates or tries to develop their own identity. Instead the kid is totally unprepared to handle normal situations of failure and success because they are on a emotional rollercoaster with their parents. Does that make sense?

          • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:27 PM #

            yes it does completely. The sad thing is most of them repeat the cycle with their own kids.

  24. Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:17 PM #

    Littlebells,

    you still with us?

    • littlebells July 19, 2011 at 8:25 PM #

      yes but im on my phone at swim lessons. u have all made so many good comments so please check back tomorrow for my responses!!!!

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:26 PM #

        ok. I didn’t want you pulling your hair out of your head or anything.

  25. Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:24 PM #

    Also while i was researching I found some intresting/fun tidbits about the miss america pageant. The winner used to be crowned while wearing a bathing suit. Well that was changed in the 40’s I believe and the winner wore a gown. The press got so mad that she wasn’t wearing a bathing suit they threatened to leave. So the runners-up had to wear the bathing suits while the winner wore the gown.

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:37 PM #

      SMH!

      Paris-
      Do u think we have we gone from bad to worse with beauty pageants? I mean as women have become more independent Adult beauty pageants are not as popular so now they have moved onto children? Have we just switched to children because they are the most vulnerable?

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:39 PM #

        IMO, I think so. honestly the pageants are more for the parents than the child.

    • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 8:37 PM #

      That’s terrible.

  26. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 8:38 PM #

    I grew up close to Warren Buffett. Not sure if you know who he is, but owns Berkshire Hathaway. His kids were not given anything. They went to public school, had to pay for there own college. They had to make there own way. He did not want them to grow up with “silver spoons” in there mouths.

    Paris- I did not take it that you were yelling at me.

    IMO (and I’m not a parent or even close to becoming one), but kids seem to need instant gratification. Maybe that is why there are so many kids wanting to become actors, singers etc. They want money, fame etc and think that is the quickest way. Look at all of the reality shows, T&T included.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:43 PM #

      Francesa,

      I know who Warren Buffett is (not personally but i’ve seen him on t.v.) I like him alot. I’m glad that he raised his children to be able to know what hardwork is and that even though they have “everything” they still need to work for what they have.

      IMO children today are not taught to work for what they have but to wait for the hand out.

  27. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 8:44 PM #

    OB ITA with you. Children are vulnerable and what is even more disturbing is that the very people that are supposed to protect them are the ones victimizing them. The only reason I say that is the kids as stated before do not know any different. It makes you wonder, if they did show resistance would the parent let them stop? Hmm?

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:48 PM #

      Francesa,

      From what I’ve seen. Some parents do let the child stop and some don’t. I guess it just depends on whats at stake and the parent doesn’t care about about the mental/emotional wellbeing of the child, imo.

  28. Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:49 PM #

    I think a lot of kids are being raised on TV, the internet etc.. They don’t have good role models and I’m sorry don’t learn how to develop themselves spiritually. Instead they are looking for things outside of them to feel a void.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:50 PM #

      Open Book,

      I think you hit the nail on the head. They don’t know how to develop themselves spiritually. That I think is key otherwise how would they feel a void?

  29. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 8:50 PM #

    Once again, this makes me sad. You are correct though as stated in your original article, it does border on abuse.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:52 PM #

      It makes me sad too. That’s why I wanted to shed some light on it. Let kids be kids if they choose to enter a pageant when they are older then that’s ok that’s their choice. Give them some solid foundations first.

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 9:00 PM #

        Well said. ITA

    • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 8:54 PM #

      Yes, very sad indeed and yet there are no laws to protect kids who have dip ***** for parents.

      • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:56 PM #

        no there are no laws to protect them. Its sad.

        • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 8:59 PM #

          I always thought people would look into the pageants when JonBenet died. You know really look at them and see who is coming to them and what can be done to protect the girls but nothing was done at least not to my knowledge.

          • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 9:03 PM #

            Yes me too. But these pageants bring in a lot of dough and stimulate the economy these pageants are being held in. People are turning a blinds eye because they can and kids can’t defend themselves.

            • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 9:07 PM #

              IMO, there should be a law that says the child has to be a certain age to enter if they aren’t going to stop them if they aren’t going to be regulated.

  30. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 8:59 PM #

    But how can they develop spiritually when they are being raised by television and internet? And once again the parents, where are they??

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 9:01 PM #

      That’s true. IMO, the parents are worrying about themselves and expect the child to raise him/herself.

      • Open Book July 19, 2011 at 9:05 PM #

        Standing O! Paris u said it.

        “the parents are worrying about themselves and expect the child to raise him/herself.”

        It’s like everyman for themselves. WHAT TOOLS!!!

        • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 9:09 PM #

          ****takes bow***** Thank you Thank you. 🙂

  31. Francesa July 19, 2011 at 9:06 PM #

    Well conference call is waiting. Will check back later for any new comments. I have not yet seen Harry Potter, but hope to this week. Work came before play, yet once again.

    Have a great night. Hope to be here Thursday..

    Thanks for a great discussion.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 9:08 PM #

      Thanks for stopping by Francesa!

  32. Open Book July 19, 2011 at 9:10 PM #

    Everyone-

    I have to go now. This topic is such a large one and we only scratched the surface.

    Paris-great article and thanks for being courageous enough to begin the discussion on LIH. It’s really a sore topic for me personally but one that needs to be dealt with.

    • Parisienne July 19, 2011 at 9:13 PM #

      You are welcome. Thanks for coming everyone and have a good night!

      • ozzie20 July 19, 2011 at 9:15 PM #

        Bye all! Great discussion!

  33. Littlebells July 19, 2011 at 11:11 PM #

    Ummm….can I just tell you my inner self is weeping tears of joy!!!! *huge hug around this entire group* I am so thankful to know such a smart, funny, moral, common sense thinking women! *squeezes group*

    Seriously, ITA with everything you have written and OB, Ozzie, Paris, and Francesa, I would love to put this article on my blog and quote you. Do I have your permission?

    I have so much I want to say and I think it would be better for me to write out my dissertation there as opposed to restate everything you have just said.

    Let me know! truly a fantastic discussion ladies! I’m so honored to know you! 🙂

    (CR, despite not being a woman, I’m including you in this and sorry you missed out on the group hug. Anyone want to light candles and sing Kumbaya?)

    • Parisienne July 20, 2011 at 8:03 AM #

      LittleBells,

      You may put this on your blog. 🙂 *hugs* Hope you have a great day!

      • comic relief July 20, 2011 at 2:15 PM #

        The discusssion seemed great I hope we return to this subject in the future.

        • Littlebells July 20, 2011 at 3:00 PM #

          I’m sure we will! We have the whole Hollywood Stage parents angle to cover! haha! 🙂

          Paris,
          thanks!!! I’ll let you know when it’s up. 🙂

          • comic relief July 20, 2011 at 4:15 PM #

            Hmmmmmm unfortunately, I think you are kidding (and wish you weren’t). I was serious about what I said, there was some part of that landscape I wanted to know about?

            I know 1.) the kids are innocent and incapable of understanding any of the adult facination the parents’ lavish on them, 2.) I understand the parents should be locked up but I don’t understand how they (the parents) loose the perspective that motivates their obsessive behavior….

            • comic relief July 20, 2011 at 4:20 PM #

              Many of you claimed the parents are unfulfilled but they have laws, peer evaluation, and financial hurdles to stand in their way as obstacles against their fulfillment and satifaction.

              Still the practice continues.

              Oh well I missed out, though there may be other ways to reconnect with this topic in the future.

            • Littlebells July 20, 2011 at 4:21 PM #

              Oh no I am DEFINITELY not kidding!!!!! Sorry, my fed up with idiot cackle didn’t translate. Sorry. But I agree with everything you said. It’s a very serious manner and Paris only barely got us to scratch the surface!

              • comic relief July 20, 2011 at 7:06 PM #

                O.k.,

                Sorry, I didn’t think you weren’t serious. I’ll move on, sorry for the misinterpretation. 🙂

  34. Open Book July 20, 2011 at 8:39 PM #

    CR & LB-

    I think this is just the tip of the iceberg regarding this topic. Hopefully Paris will be kind enough to re-visit this topic again. Sorry u missed out on a great discussion CR!!

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